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shroomahuasca seemed notably different than the Lu Gen ayahuasca. There was no ego transcendence with the Lu Gen. Also, I got the typical ataxia with the Lu Gen... couldn't walk at all. Rubbery legs. Resembles "phalaris staggers" in livestock.
Classic jungle ayahuascas with a lot of DMT plant in them 'leave no one standing" well known that you can't walk on high dose ayahuasca. well, then... with the Lu Gen Ayahuasca ... there was also the repeated waves of projectile vomiting. I made a brew of 11 grams of ground Esphand (Peganum harmala) seed in water. This resulted in clearcut hallucinations that were qualitatively different than anything else I'd done. Mostly in tones of blue and brown. Very buzzy experience, with vomiting so, harmala alkaloids are directly hallucinogenic. about 3.5 to 5 grams of ground peganum harmala, extracted in 4 changes of water just sufficient to cover the material and boiled for about 5 minutes each time, strained, is plenty to get poteniation, yet doesn't (for me) induce nausea or vomiting. that,combined with 2.5 to 3.5 grams of cubensis mushrooms is very interesting. extends the experience to about 8+ hours, going farther out, but with less of a biological/neural load. The only dissonance was that adrenaline rushes persist for 20 minutes.
So, if something throws me a curve while tripping on shroomahuasca, I'm jangled for about 5 to 20 minutes and it gets kind of stale. the sense of shamanic control from shroomahuasca is very interesting. There also seems to be much more telepathy happening. heh. on Lu Gen + Esphand, other trippers (this 'hallucinated telepathically') didn't know what to make of my mind field. one guy walked by my tent and said "LSD and Cocaine?" I think the persistent ego (everything still gets referenced through "I") is kind of perplexing. "if this guy is this high, how come he's being such a heavy handed control freak?" perhaps. the ego persistence may explain why ayahuasqueros get into these little battles, sending "virotes" after each other and little magic darts, and all the sorcerer-rivalries they have. I don't think you see that at all with shrooms. honestly, from the anthro record and accounts, control seems to be the main reason for shamanism. They're trying to control diseases, recover stuff, gain power animals and allies, etc.
The ayahuasquero-curandero is kind of the center of attention, running around playing a rattle, singing icaros, administering to people having various issues, singing hallucinations into existence. egolessness is a fairly modern idea. It's a huxley-grof-leary thing. well, it's also buddhist-hindu. ideally. but the hindus are one of the worst heirarchical brutal systems you can imagine. seach google for "hindu caste murder"
Hinduism and the caste system is a horrible step-and-fetch-it hereditary apartheid system. people try to say "oh, the caste system isn't really part of hindusim" .. uh.. it is. It's even central to it. everyone wants everything 'spiritual' to be beautiful. Most major brand name heirarchical religiuons are contrived to keep an elite in power. heh. Vimanas... the flying machines... those weird huge palindromic poems that read the same in all directions. Vedas and Upanishads are repositories for everything the hindu empire knew. If you did anything you wrote a sutra or veda about it. shamanism is usually intended to maintain community, however, shamanism is pretty focused on the shaman's performance. It's this kind of community theater. It's somewhat used to put the whammy on people and keep them socially adjusted. shamanism is a modern idea invented by Mircea Eliade. It's an anthro hypothesis. if you mean 'siberian shamanism' then you're talking about one specific culture, and can probaby determine specifics. well. Oppenheimer used the quote from the Ramayana for dramatic effect. God blowing things up. "behold, I am become Death, Destroyer of Worlds". it was more a quizzical expression of doubt about the morality of what they'd done. it's unlikely hinduism had anything to do with the origin of the atomic bomb. unless you want to posit some kind of long-enduring power mania derived from Indo-European culture out of the Indus Valley, Sumeria and Egypt. 'the purpose of theocracy is to rule the world" I suppose or the universe. >snicker<
The closest thing in modern culture to Hindu scriptures are saturday morning cartoons, like Transformers and Go-Bots. I also wonder to what extent obssessive-compulsive disorder informed ancient religions. Graphomania, etc.
Screwball fantasies that impressed the heck out of everyone. I don't really see why people insist on attributing their own very good vibes and ideas to these proto-nazi cultures, like they're trying to backdate their own discovereies to make them seem like "ancient wisdom' or give them some sort of heavy authority. I think people should take credit for being cool themselves, if they are innovators, it's as valid and meaningful as it would be if they were somehow just rediscovering some ancient inscription. or the urge to project resonance onto things where it doesn't exist. or perhaps you can make resonance. doesn't matter if it was there before or not. You create resonance. You can make ancient texts resonate to your own assertions. uh, morphic resonance works forward in time, not backward. also, you are overgeneralizing factoids about subatomic events to human culture. I think one huge effect of ancient cultures was to exterminate heretics. The Hindus did this, the Egyptians did this, Christians did it. Jews did it (check deuteronomy for a list of people you're supposed to exterminate/stone to death) the net effect of this 'ancient wisdom' to kill anyone who disagrees with you., or other cultures, and take all their stuff, is that humans are selectively bred not to rock the boat.
Humans now have all these inbred compliance and awe reflexes. look how distorted cattle, corn and dogs are. Humans have been doing that to themselves for tens of thousands of years, or longer. Religion and culture are this huge selective breeding experiment that works by killing heretics.
This also explains things like caste and class and royal marriage conventions. The dominant group keeps it's gene pool separate from their peons. I looked around for DNA evidence regarding caste interbreeding. even though hindu castes have lived in close proximity, daily contact, for 1000s of years, they have distinct genepools.
There are interesting modern accounts of lower caste boyfriends or girlfriends of upper-caste sons or daughters being murdered if they try to date across caste lines. recently a bunch of field workers were slaughtered by Brahmins after they tried to form a farmworker's union. however, I don't identify with much of this. I've been going for the mutant identity thing, somewhat, if I even have to play an identity game. well, artificial selection comes into play when you have symbolic languages and social organization. you see the same thing in ants, bees and termites. Once they evolved occupational specialization... heh. Thorstein Veblen, this economist that was a contemporary of Mark Twain and Karl Marx somewhat, has this very humorous (yet serious) book "The Theory of the Leisure Class". mind is an open system. did you make your mind, or did your mind make you? Most of our minds come from somewhere other than our bodies. like, I sure didn't invent the English language. it's entirely possible that you are smarter than god. normally, you'd think that a larger-scale construct composed of intelligent subsystems would be smarter than the subsystems. turns out that's not neccessarily true. The density of interconnection between subsystems matters. the overmind may be totally retarded, even unconscious. it's also possible that ultraworld/overmind phenomena only happen when people are in extraordinary states. Then the overmind wakes up for a while. then they come down, and the overmind evaporates.
Evolution is good at certain kind of mind-like processes. however, I suspect evolution really likes symbolic thought and fast, tight feedback looks and look-ahead capabilities. Which are things it apparently doesn't have without human-like neural systems around.
Evolution just responds to survival pressure, environmental and contextual change and mutations. It's not teleological or purposive.
There may be strange attractors that make evolution converge toward certain states or processes. darn. Stuart Kauffman's stuff used to be online. It got published . and now you have to buy the book. He has some really interesting things to say about how there's an intrinsic thermodynamic tendency to mutual catalysis and complexification.
ok. here's the good stuff: http://www.santafe.edu/sfi/People/kauffman/Investigations.html